I have just read this weeks Methodist Recorder and was drawn to read a letter from Mike Bossingham on the topic of the itinerant ministry of ministers within Methodism.
I have to say I found the letter quite interesting and have a great deal of sympathy with the points made in the letter.
Like many of our members I suppose I do have some reservations about a change from itinerant to a more permanent style of ministry, as I realise that there have been and possibly always will be situations where there are square pegs in round holes, but conversely I recognise that the five year timespan can be rather limiting and that ministers may not have really got into the full swing of their ministry.
I was involved in the re-invitation process this year and felt it was a rather unpleasant process, and although it was done in accordance with the guidelines it seemed to be a very rushed and almost impersonal system.
I would have thought there was a better way of doing this and surely there must be a better way of dealing with the stationing than the system we have, but then I suspect some of the best minds in Methodism have looked at this in some depth and not it seems been able to come up with a better way.
I think I would have to say that there are a couple of things that I have always thought about the ministry and the itinerant nature of it. The first one is that I had always believed that the ministry was a calling and as such the response was to go where God sends. The other thing and I believe this is true for those in any type of employment is that we go into any job aware of the terms and conditions of that job, and when one is called to the Methodist ministry it is to a ministry that is quite clearly an itinerant ministry. I know when I applied for my current job a few years ago the terms and conditions were quite clearly laid down in the advertisement and in the pack that accompanied the application form. I applied knowing full well what I was going into. I would have thought given the process someone called to ministry has to go through they would be quite clear what was involved in employment terms especially if they feel called as an ordinary member - after all it might be a fairly long time period before they become a minister given that hey have to be a local preacher first and then go through the candidating process etc.
I am not sure what the answer is to this and I dare say that there will be some response in the Recorder on both sides of the coin. It is to be hoped that whatever the response it leads to a realistic assessment of the situation and perhaps even some serious thought on how we might develop the way we do ministry in this 21st Century.
Showing posts with label Methodist Ministers. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Methodist Ministers. Show all posts
Thursday, 12 February 2009
Monday, 3 March 2008
Ministers as Evangelists!
I had previously said I would not comment on this matter but there is so much debate going on around the blogs I read that I thought I would offer a view that hopefully will not be controversial or cause any dire reactions from readers.
I think given the nature of circuit structures, lack of ministers across the connexion and other issues it is highly likely that the minister of a church is seen once a month if you are lucky and possibly more if you are really lucky - given this situation how can it be reasonably expected that the minister should be solely responsible for any particular aspect of chruch life whether it be preaching, teaching or evangelism. In reality the majority of our services are taken by local preachers and much of the day to day life of the church seems to be down to the members of the church. It is true to say that in many places services are taken fairly regularly by that wonderful chap 'Local Arrangement' and even here in Walsall we have had to resort to readers services this quarter to fill all the dates on the plan.
There is a responsibility on all of us for the life and witness of the local fellowship and while not everyone can stand at the front and lead worship or preach there are many things that we can all do.
Apart from when I had preached there one of my first visits to our church was on a Sunday evening - we arrived for what was listed on the plan as a 6-30p.m. service at around 6-25p.m. and it had actually started at 6p.m. For all this we were made most welcome and chairs were moved so that we could join the circle. We had been looking for a new place of worship and had tried one or two churches during the previous month before we arrived at Pleck on that first Sunday Evening and 10 years on we are still there and believe that we are where God wants us to be.
It is true to say that Pleck is an unusual church in some ways - nobody takes any notice when people arrive late for a service - we have an extremely transient congregation as we have had and still have a ministry to asylum seekers, we love to sing anything and everything whether it be Wesley or Kendrick, Crosby or Redman and preferably with a mix of each. We try new and differnt ideas but will also run with the extremely traditional hymn sandwich with every hymn from Hymns and Psalms and I do believe we offer our love to evryone who comes across our threshold.
I am of the opinion that much of what we do as a church is an extremely effective method of evangelism as we show our love to those who come in. Recently a new housing complex has opened just across the road from us and we really felt it would be a nice gesture to give each new resident a welcome pack with tea,coffee, biscuits and a little welcome card in. We spoke to the owners and they were happy for us to do this and a card was left with the packs telling people who were are and where we are and saying that we would love to see them at our coffee morning on the first Saturday of the month - who knows what may come of that?
Some years ago I read a book about friendship evangelism by Rebecca Manley Pippert I think and while I did not agree with everything she wrote I could see the sense in being friends with people as well as trying to evangelise them.
I think given the nature of circuit structures, lack of ministers across the connexion and other issues it is highly likely that the minister of a church is seen once a month if you are lucky and possibly more if you are really lucky - given this situation how can it be reasonably expected that the minister should be solely responsible for any particular aspect of chruch life whether it be preaching, teaching or evangelism. In reality the majority of our services are taken by local preachers and much of the day to day life of the church seems to be down to the members of the church. It is true to say that in many places services are taken fairly regularly by that wonderful chap 'Local Arrangement' and even here in Walsall we have had to resort to readers services this quarter to fill all the dates on the plan.
There is a responsibility on all of us for the life and witness of the local fellowship and while not everyone can stand at the front and lead worship or preach there are many things that we can all do.
Apart from when I had preached there one of my first visits to our church was on a Sunday evening - we arrived for what was listed on the plan as a 6-30p.m. service at around 6-25p.m. and it had actually started at 6p.m. For all this we were made most welcome and chairs were moved so that we could join the circle. We had been looking for a new place of worship and had tried one or two churches during the previous month before we arrived at Pleck on that first Sunday Evening and 10 years on we are still there and believe that we are where God wants us to be.
It is true to say that Pleck is an unusual church in some ways - nobody takes any notice when people arrive late for a service - we have an extremely transient congregation as we have had and still have a ministry to asylum seekers, we love to sing anything and everything whether it be Wesley or Kendrick, Crosby or Redman and preferably with a mix of each. We try new and differnt ideas but will also run with the extremely traditional hymn sandwich with every hymn from Hymns and Psalms and I do believe we offer our love to evryone who comes across our threshold.
I am of the opinion that much of what we do as a church is an extremely effective method of evangelism as we show our love to those who come in. Recently a new housing complex has opened just across the road from us and we really felt it would be a nice gesture to give each new resident a welcome pack with tea,coffee, biscuits and a little welcome card in. We spoke to the owners and they were happy for us to do this and a card was left with the packs telling people who were are and where we are and saying that we would love to see them at our coffee morning on the first Saturday of the month - who knows what may come of that?
Some years ago I read a book about friendship evangelism by Rebecca Manley Pippert I think and while I did not agree with everything she wrote I could see the sense in being friends with people as well as trying to evangelise them.
Monday, 1 October 2007
A good read!
Been doing a lot of reading the last week in between travelling the length and breadth of the country - well sort of. Went to the District LP meeting last Thursday at Dawley and was disappointed that only 7 out of 21 circuits were represented even though the meeting was very good and some interesting things discussed.
On Friday evening after work I drove down to Alton in Hampshire to help my son's girlfriend to move out of the flat she had been living in - worst thing was the fact that the flat was up 55 steps on the third floor of a very large house. Drove back on Friday night as well and then went to Oswaldtwistle and Feniscowen (Nr Blackburn) on Saturday.
Sunday I was playing the organ in the morning and preaching in the evening so another busy day.
I have been reading other blogs rather than writing my own and there has been some interesting and quite controversial stuff during the last week or so - I have to say that two of my favourite reads are a column in my local evening paper the Express and Star, which is written by a born again atheist called Peter Rhodes and the blog of methodistpreacher.com. They can both be very challenging and may sometimes get right up peoples noses - I know there are times when I could cheerfully burn Peter Rhode's column, especially when he is having a pop at Christians - funny how he hardly ever has a go at any other religious groups. On the other hand methodist preacher seems to raise a number of interesting points some of which I agree with and some I don't, and I think it has to be said that he certainly generates lots of comments from other people. Another site I like to look at is connexions but there are times when I have to reach for my dictionary as it seems to be a site where a lot of highly educated people post and I am just an ordinary common or garden Black Country Lad and dare I say proud of it.
There has been some discussion elsewhere about the use of titles and qualifications and whether we should use them or not - like some other bloggers I have a qualification that is relevant to my occupation and not necessarily relevant to my church life so initially I didn't ask for it to be put on the plan. I did find though that some people seemed to judge me as being a bit thick because I speak with a very broad Black Country accent so I asked if my letters could be put on the plan. Its quite amazing to me that no one has ever asked me what they mean but perhaps it paints a slightly different picture of me for some.
I note the discussion about ministers and agree with the one comment I read that you can have a situation where half the congregation think the minister is great while others will have a totally opposite view. As I travel round our circuit I pick up lots of comments about both ministers and other local preachers and I suspect others pick up comments about me and I think this is very much part of life. I am fairly certain that my style of leading worship may not appeal to everybody - I am not a great fan of Hymns and Psalms (shock, horror) and prefer to use what on of my local preacher colleagues refers to as the 'Funny Book' i.e. Mission Praise. I am fairly sure if I go to the church this particular preacher attends and use Mission Praise he will straight away be unhappy, so I have no illusions about. It has to be said though that the church I preached at last night may have been quite surprised because I did use Hymns and Psalms due to their other book being 'The Source' which is another good and varied collection but perhaps better in the mornings when the congregation is bigger and has more younger people present. I suspect that many of the congregation would have been reasonably happy last night because I used H & P.
Again with the discussion relating to ministers I think that sometimes there is an expectation that they will be all things to all people and of course the reality is that every one of us has a range of skills and abilities. I believe we should never expect one person to have all the skills and abilities in the same way that no one person has all the answers - perhaps what we should look for much more is a collaborative ministry - for instance and this is one I feel quite strongly about - why do we expect ministers to chair all of our meetings?(I know Standing Order 502 and 027 and 028 in CPD) Some are very good at this but others seem to struggle and waffle prolonging meetings and meaning that often important discussion or business that may be towards the end of the meeting is rushed or not even discussed. Perhaps this is something we could look at and enable lay people who may be well experienced in this type of thing to take on these roles. Just in case anybody thinks it I am not trying to throw ministers or superintendents out or having a go at them but there really are things that I don't think I could do that they do and likewise there are times I think when there are things they are expected to do that others could.
One thing I would find extremely difficult is visiting the bereaved, especially if I knew the deceased person well as I am one of those men who do not think men shouldn't cry and in fact I could cry at Lassie films so visiting the bereaved would probably have me in tears.
Just a last thought about titles and the use of them - I saw a leaflet a couple of weeks ago for a special service which would be led by Reverend Doctor The Lord Griffiths - wouldn't Lord Griffiths have been sufficient? Surely most of us in Methodism know who he is and what his titles are - even those of us like me who are not dyed in the wool Methodists - ah well got to fetch my wife from work so signing off now. Goodnight readers.
On Friday evening after work I drove down to Alton in Hampshire to help my son's girlfriend to move out of the flat she had been living in - worst thing was the fact that the flat was up 55 steps on the third floor of a very large house. Drove back on Friday night as well and then went to Oswaldtwistle and Feniscowen (Nr Blackburn) on Saturday.
Sunday I was playing the organ in the morning and preaching in the evening so another busy day.
I have been reading other blogs rather than writing my own and there has been some interesting and quite controversial stuff during the last week or so - I have to say that two of my favourite reads are a column in my local evening paper the Express and Star, which is written by a born again atheist called Peter Rhodes and the blog of methodistpreacher.com. They can both be very challenging and may sometimes get right up peoples noses - I know there are times when I could cheerfully burn Peter Rhode's column, especially when he is having a pop at Christians - funny how he hardly ever has a go at any other religious groups. On the other hand methodist preacher seems to raise a number of interesting points some of which I agree with and some I don't, and I think it has to be said that he certainly generates lots of comments from other people. Another site I like to look at is connexions but there are times when I have to reach for my dictionary as it seems to be a site where a lot of highly educated people post and I am just an ordinary common or garden Black Country Lad and dare I say proud of it.
There has been some discussion elsewhere about the use of titles and qualifications and whether we should use them or not - like some other bloggers I have a qualification that is relevant to my occupation and not necessarily relevant to my church life so initially I didn't ask for it to be put on the plan. I did find though that some people seemed to judge me as being a bit thick because I speak with a very broad Black Country accent so I asked if my letters could be put on the plan. Its quite amazing to me that no one has ever asked me what they mean but perhaps it paints a slightly different picture of me for some.
I note the discussion about ministers and agree with the one comment I read that you can have a situation where half the congregation think the minister is great while others will have a totally opposite view. As I travel round our circuit I pick up lots of comments about both ministers and other local preachers and I suspect others pick up comments about me and I think this is very much part of life. I am fairly certain that my style of leading worship may not appeal to everybody - I am not a great fan of Hymns and Psalms (shock, horror) and prefer to use what on of my local preacher colleagues refers to as the 'Funny Book' i.e. Mission Praise. I am fairly sure if I go to the church this particular preacher attends and use Mission Praise he will straight away be unhappy, so I have no illusions about. It has to be said though that the church I preached at last night may have been quite surprised because I did use Hymns and Psalms due to their other book being 'The Source' which is another good and varied collection but perhaps better in the mornings when the congregation is bigger and has more younger people present. I suspect that many of the congregation would have been reasonably happy last night because I used H & P.
Again with the discussion relating to ministers I think that sometimes there is an expectation that they will be all things to all people and of course the reality is that every one of us has a range of skills and abilities. I believe we should never expect one person to have all the skills and abilities in the same way that no one person has all the answers - perhaps what we should look for much more is a collaborative ministry - for instance and this is one I feel quite strongly about - why do we expect ministers to chair all of our meetings?(I know Standing Order 502 and 027 and 028 in CPD) Some are very good at this but others seem to struggle and waffle prolonging meetings and meaning that often important discussion or business that may be towards the end of the meeting is rushed or not even discussed. Perhaps this is something we could look at and enable lay people who may be well experienced in this type of thing to take on these roles. Just in case anybody thinks it I am not trying to throw ministers or superintendents out or having a go at them but there really are things that I don't think I could do that they do and likewise there are times I think when there are things they are expected to do that others could.
One thing I would find extremely difficult is visiting the bereaved, especially if I knew the deceased person well as I am one of those men who do not think men shouldn't cry and in fact I could cry at Lassie films so visiting the bereaved would probably have me in tears.
Just a last thought about titles and the use of them - I saw a leaflet a couple of weeks ago for a special service which would be led by Reverend Doctor The Lord Griffiths - wouldn't Lord Griffiths have been sufficient? Surely most of us in Methodism know who he is and what his titles are - even those of us like me who are not dyed in the wool Methodists - ah well got to fetch my wife from work so signing off now. Goodnight readers.
Thursday, 19 July 2007
Why 6?
Been a while since I posed a why so I thought it was time to ask one again and it is one that puzzles me to a great extent and I am not sure that there is an answer or if there may be a number of answers but I believe it is worth the asking.
I understand that our ministers are allocated following a strange system called stationing and I understand that they come for a specific period of time which can be extended but my why is to do with the extension part of the process.
Why can some ministers stay for many years in a circuit while others seem to move around frequently? I went to Conference in 1983 in Plymouth and for much of the week sat next to one of the ministers from our district who is still serving in the same circuit 24 years later - I can understand if there is a minister doing an absolutely marvellous job and in charge of a growing and vibrant church there may be a reluctance to let them move on, but surely the foundation of Methodism is in the very nature of the itinerant ministry exercised by John Wesley.
I look foward to readers views on this.
I understand that our ministers are allocated following a strange system called stationing and I understand that they come for a specific period of time which can be extended but my why is to do with the extension part of the process.
Why can some ministers stay for many years in a circuit while others seem to move around frequently? I went to Conference in 1983 in Plymouth and for much of the week sat next to one of the ministers from our district who is still serving in the same circuit 24 years later - I can understand if there is a minister doing an absolutely marvellous job and in charge of a growing and vibrant church there may be a reluctance to let them move on, but surely the foundation of Methodism is in the very nature of the itinerant ministry exercised by John Wesley.
I look foward to readers views on this.
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